Harimedia Forum

Nanda-grama wrote:May be, it is impossible to explain what is God, but it is miracle that it is possible to feel Him and associate with Him(or Them)!

That may be indeed so, but as I understood you and what Hari writes is that we altogether are that entity commonly called God and by saying that "it is possible to feel Him and associate with Him (or Them) we would in reality "feel" and become aware of our own Being. He writes "We are the sum total collective of all living energy." Or have I understood something quite wrong and have gotten the wrong idea from that what he wrote?

Do you currently believe that "God" is a separate entity or is "God" actually everything that exists and not separate from "itself" or "Himself"?

Jesus also prayed that his disciples should be one just as Jesus and the Father are one. Obviously, he was not praying that all his disciples should somehow merge into one individual. And when Luke reports that the disciples were all one, Luke does not mean that they became one single human being, but that they shared a common purpose although they were separate beings.

I was reading ones the book by Richard Dawkins called "The God Delusion" In The God Delusion Dawkins defines God as a "superhuman, supernatural intelligence who deliberately designed and created the universe and everything in it". This definition exemplifies what can be called an ontological conception of God, that is, God is something that exists, that has being, and is separate and independent of other things that exist (such as ourselves). That something might be an impersonal power or force, or it might be a supernatural, living being (whatever that might consist of) with a personality. Traditionally, Christians and other theists like the Vaishnavas have adopted the latter view, as apologist Richard Swinburne expressed so well: "Theism claims that God is a personal being—that is, in some sense a person. By a person I mean an individual with basic powers (to act intentionally), purposes, and beliefs". In other words, God is a "who," not a "what."

Found on www.reinventingmyself.com/god.html


"God and Love are probably the two words that have more meanings or at least
more diverse reactions or perceptions than any other. Most of us have been
brought up with strong beliefs about both and in most cases, we have learned
that God and Love are the same or at least closely related.

For many people, God has been explained within the realms of religion and
although there are many different religions, most of them have the same basic
belief: that God is a superhuman being or source, which created the universe
and everything within it. God symbolizes, embodies and possesses divine
powers. God has control over nature, human experience, life and death.

Of course, this is an over-simplification but for now if we can just think of God
as the creator and controlling force of the Universe and consider that God and
Love are one and the same, then we may all accept some common ground.

To imagine God, we may have to put aside religious beliefs for just a moment
and focus on what we feel deep inside. Feeling or sensing God might be what
we consider to be the experience of spirituality. Spirituality is also one of those
words with many explanations but again if we keep it simple, we might think of
it as: experiencing God as a source within us.

Some may feel this as a higher state of consciousness, a sense of renewal, inner
peace, healing or inspiration. Perhaps, a state of euphoria or a sense of self, as a
soul.

I’m trying to avoid religious dogma here and simply find some common ground.
I do not wish to try and explain or preach any particular doctrine or theosophy;
I simply wish to use the name God. Who or what God is has been argued,
studied, pondered and discussed throughout the ages.

God has many names and just as many meanings. Usually when God is
mentioned we automatically fall into whatever faith we were raised with and
start discussing religion.

Many people find it difficult or almost impossible to separate religion and God.
Again, I will try and simplify this and suggest that religion is man’s knowledge,
study or analysis of who and what God is. Religion almost always dictates an
allegiance to a church or denomination. One joins a church much like a member
of any organization and tries to live in accordance with the codes of conduct
and philosophy of that organization. Very few people explore all religions and
yet most will argue that only theirs is right. Most of the time we simply adopt the
belief system of our family, culture or location.

For many people, their religion is their pathway to spirituality. For others, it is a
venue or simply a place for like-minded people to gather and explore that
particular avenue. In effect, most churches (or temples) represent themselves
as agents of God.

Some people experience a deep sense of spirituality and are led to a religion
and others are bought up within a religion and are led to spirituality.

The reason I am being so careful here is that I want to explore spirituality and
love as a natural state of being. I am not talking about religion but I want to use
the word God in the context of exploring life as a spiritual experience.

Some people are lucky enough to live each day as a spiritual being within a
physical reality. These people are filled with joy and a sense of serenity. Life
makes sense at this level and there is an acknowledgement of gratitude. These
people do not fear death and have a very deep sense of security. They feel
connected to their environment and the people around them. There is a healing
force within them and this energy often radiate from them. There is a wisdom
that they can access and a purpose in which they live. They do not experience
God as a separate entity. God is love and God is light and God is within them.
___

On the other hand in the Gita Krishna tells Arjuna who feared all kinds of sinful
reactions when he would engage in warfare at the holy site of Kurukshetra:

sarva-dharman parityajya
mam ekam saranam vraja
aham tvam sarva-papebhyo
moksayisyami ma sucah

"Abandon all varieties of religion [dharma, occupational duty] and just surrender unto Me. I shall
deliver you form all sinful reactions, do not fear." (18.66)

Its interesting in this regard that although Krishna assured only Arjuna that when he would surrender unto him or in other words do what he ordered him to do, (BG 18.60: "Under illusion you are now declining to act according to My direction. But, compelled by the work born of your own nature, you will act all the same, O son of Kunti.") that he would free him of all sinful reactions, which would result by engaging in the war of Kurukshetra, many think that he meant me and all of us also. But I may not be inclined to engage myself in a warfare of any-kind nor for the sake of anyone or any purpose - I may be a pacifist - and since the conversation between Krishna and Arjuna have past more that 5000 years. A lot of time where the circumstances changed a lot also. So such an opinion could be for me personally indeed a statement empty of any meaning.

ok,it was many years ago and you are not Arjuna- but you can ask God what He wants from you now.

And that although you don't believe in God as a separate entity or do you?

Since the beginning, human beings have sought answers to spiritual questions, motivated by a basic urge to understand the meaning of life. To downgrade or explain everything on the level of feelings is in my opinion just a kind of sentimentalism.

You write:

Nanda-grama wrote:I would advice you (if generally I can advice something you) to read source of this phrase "This is only One of us" - "Conversations with God" of N.D.Walsh. This is such term which can't be explained in 2-3 postings. This is another point of view on (the) world. In this book God explains it. Then I would advice you (after this book) to look on world from this point of view and to try to get personal experience of it.

I have this books and was reading them as well in German as also in the Romanian language when I found them in one of my visit in Romania. In my opinion Walsh is a great writer with a great gift to write that down what he considers to be Gods words. If this is or was indeed so who knows.

You write "In this book God explains it" that sounds to me as if you are raising this books by N.D.Walsh on the level of some revelated scriptures. I have my doubts and am somehow sceptical to view them like that. Why should I do that? Would or should that change something in my understanding of what is written therein?

Like I said before I was reading them all and also the newest book by Walsh. And they are interesting and refreshing to read, entirely different from reading the books of Prabhupada for example or any other traditionalistic writer. But if you ask me if I accept everything what is written therein I must say I'm not sure I always accept even 80% of what I read in anything.

But this I find Ok and a change of perspective in my opinion which tells me that this person or divine entity commonly called God or Radha-Krishna or whatever can talk and reveal himself even today to some people or to me and not only than a few thousand years ago.

And than when you open yourself up to other compilations of spiritual truths (like the Conversations With God series) or other books and texts you'll see that it's more about individual responsibility rather than blind acceptance of another's authority. From everything I know to be true based on my experience and my personal growth – not some prefabricated force-fed belief system – these 'other' books have divine truths within too.

As three part beings (body, mind and spirit) we are capable of earthly things, our spirits capable of Godly things and our minds are usually the barrier. The way to help your mind become the bridge to connecting body and soul is to ask questions for yourself. Seek truth for yourself and from no one else. In other words, be open to 'other' ideas and systems of thought and teaching.

Harsi wrote:
And that although you don't believe in God as a separate entity or do you?

I don't think about God as about separated from me or from everybody or from everything entity. But it does't mean that God stops to be personality! Dvaita-advaita, Harsi.
I advised you to read Uolsh in order you would understand better this phrase " One of Us". It is obviously that reading of this book didn't help you in understanding of this book. Likely it is necessarily to read it by both parencephalons not only by left. Generally, although you speak about your special " German mind"- if you pretend to discuss spiritual terms you should take care of your right parencephalon also. Otherwise it happens same as talk with crackbrain.( Did you talk with crackbrain somewhen? I did. I speak : I want to give you this apple.
He hears: "an apple". In his mind something chatters and he tells me anecdote on term"apple", then quotes some memoir on this term( do you know that crackbrains have glorious remembrance and know very many things?). Then I speak: sit down on the chair. And all repeats with word " chair". He can tell very clever things but it has not any attitude to me, this chair, this apple. He has associative brainwork, but because connection between parencephalons is disrupted his mind skims to not sink in reality.) Of cource, I blaken the picture, but it is point of what I feel when associate with you. I would advise you to do special meditation of Hari in order to improve connection between parencephalons, but I think you self know about this meditation, you simply didn't it, you only want to speak: blah,blah,blah.(I'm sorry for my directness)
I don't think about " Conversations with God" as about Scripture, I think about it as about something provocative me to associate with God.
I don't think that Uolsh is hoaxer and many other experts of channeling are also. His distinguished quality is his interest in panhuman questions( For example, it would not come in my mind to ask God such questions ) I sow Uolsh in Moscow, he doesn't think about himself as about great writer more likely as about an expert of channeling.
How do you fix presence of God? When does somebody authoritative as Prabhupada tell you about it, or when do you FEEL definite energy? How generally can you fix it if not through feeling?

Like you Nanda-grama I like it also to come straight to the point. You ask me how I would fix the presence of God. I guess what you mean to say is how I would make or manage it to be or become aware of God. Or what would enable me to perceive His divine presence? Listening to the words spoken by an authority in this field like Prabhupada or the procedure or process of feeling and assimilation of a certain energy?

What should I say I can perceive only that what my mind tells me to be true and remember the experiences I made when I thought and felt inwardly I would please the Lord by my various activities, awareness and Being. If I would "feel" the divine energy? I must say I feel sometimes by intuition in what direction I should draw or channel my attention at a certain time. If this intuition is a hint given to me by God who knows. I at least sometimes have the impression that this would be the case as an answer by God or Krishna to my prayers to him.

I personally am not so much into this brain work or that what you call connection between parencephalons. What I am really interested in is to understand a certain subject in its fullness and for that I think that my brain is sufficiently equipped with all what is needed.

You mention Dvaita-advaita. "Sri Nimbarkacharya was the exponent of the Dvaita-advaita school of philosophy. Followers of this cult worship Sri Radha and Krishna. Jiva and the world are both separate from, and identical with, Brahman." > Answers.com

"Nimbarka (probably 13th century). He established the philosophy of advaita dvaita, the simultaneous duality and non-duality: God is simultaneously one and different from the world. According to this school one attains moksha, liberation, through true knowledge and realization which one can gain through true worship of God.
For Nimbarka Krishna is not an avatar but the very nature of God and like Vallabha identifies him with the Brahman. Nimbarka was known as a particular admirer of the divine couple Radha and Krishna." > Wikipedia (germ)

This Dwaita-advaita way of seeing sounds reasonable to me, I like it to view it like that also. I think Caitanya's view is similar or? God would be in an inconceivable way at the same time one (bheda) and at the same time different (abheda) from all that exists. Thus our life, our existence and well-being is related to and in some way also dependent on the Divinity and Their, Radha Krishna's divine mercy.

Harsi wrote:
If I would "feel" the divine energy? I must say I feel sometimes by intuition in what direction I should draw or channel my attention at a certain time. If this intuition is a hint given to me by God who knows. I at least sometimes have the impression that this would be the case as an answer by God or Krishna to my prayers to him.
(ok, I self wonder my preaching tone- therefore I correct all )
I think it is most fine what you can write! Any mental construction is only prefare or suffusion of lacunes. I like to discuss this term! Yes, the energy of presence of God is very subtle and almost elusive like fragnance of flower, but if we can learn to tone ourselves on it , it will more and more real, perseptible and stable. This condition accompanys with sense of joy and of comfort in attitude of self, isn't it? All becomes more vivid and wonderful, isn't it? In this condition I can try to speak with God. Somebody can get answer as some sense, or as pictures, but I hear answer. If it is something what I didn't know before, or something what does me more happy, confident in myself and more appease or if it helps in my life - I'm sure-it is not my mind, it is real connection. If in this condition I begin to analyse or generally to think- this condition goes out. It is same as when you kiss your wife-if you will think in this time what meaning word " kiss" has in Vicipedia, what will happen?
I think that most interest and important that we can do here is to share own experience how to tone ourselves on this energy, how to learn to be in this condition constantly.

Now I sow fun video for the topic" There is only One of Us"
http://video.mail.ru/mail/kuks59/136/265.html

I don't know- English is audible here or not, but in Russian it is fine