Friends and Family in the Context of Attachment and Renunciation and Divine Love.
A lecture by Hari broadcasted live on YouTube on 1.10.2016
Watch and listen to at: https://youtu.be/GxXH34J5Wzk
..Welcome! Today I want to talk about a subject which I have discussed in the past, but a subject which I want to connect to something philosophically important. Philosophically important, spiritually important and so on. And that is, I want to talk about friendship and family.
Now I understand that these subjects are not specifically exciting, they're not specifically spiritually relevant. But they do become very spiritually relevant when we speak about them in relationship to attachment and detachment and renunciation. These subjects are very spiritually relevant. Our attention is focused on them through the Bhagavad-gita, when we speak about Lord Caitanya, specifically through Sarvabhauma Bhattacharya. He spoke about Lord Caitanya's vairagya vidya nitya bhakti yogam.
All of that of course is important, that renunciation is a significant part of spiritual life according to the Gaudiya Vaishnava tradition. But I feel that this idea of renunciation as strictly a process of giving up, has been distorted in such a way that fundamental principles of what supports our lives have been lost. In other words, renunciation is okay if you have something to renounce. I know that sounds obvious, but if you don't have something than you can't give something up.
I know that when I was a youngster I grew up catholic and we used to have something called lent where you give up something you really like. So everybody would give up something like chocolate, it was like forty days or something. Or you would give up ice cream or if you smoke to give up cigarettes. I don't know if anybody ever did that.
But during that time you renounce some enjoyment, something that you really liked for the sake of God. That worked because you were eating something or you were doing something that you could give up. It was something real that existed, something that you did, something that you liked, something that you loved and you gave up. So that in that sense renunciation worked.
2
..Another form of renunciation becomes more difficult and that also we've heard about philosophically, nirmama, the idea that nothing is mine. If nothing is yours, you have nothing to give up. Now that is very interesting. Does something belong to me or not? Is something mine or not? Well, maybe things belong to me. This is my computer, these are my earphones. I could give them up. Why would I? That's the question.
I'm using it right now in service to all of you. Therefore me giving it up, even though I could, wouldn't really make sense. And than again in another sense, is it really mine? In the sense that if I'm using it for you, is it mine? Or is it ours? That is the real issue. Is something actually mine and mine alone. You might say the body is yours and yours alone. I'm not sure about that. I heard yesterday, there is a kilo of bacteria of all forms living inside my body eating it, contributing to its weight, contributing to its existence, it's metabolism. So there's a pile of all these little things in there that also consider the body theirs.
And if you come here every other Saturday, or something like first and third Saturday a month. Is it that what I say and what I do belongs only to me, is it mine alone? Well, no! Just like every musician knows or everyone who speaks knows, every teacher knows, every person who has to interact with others know, my interaction with you is as dependent on you as it is on me.
After all if I say something to you, you don't understand it's a meaningless thing. Or if I say something to you, you really dislike it changes it's character this interaction. So, I have to be very focused on what you want, what you want to hear, who you are. So this interaction does not belong to me, neither does it belong entirely to you, it belongs to us. Every interaction we have is like that if you analyze this, it's a question of analyses.
Everything you do, everything you engage in, in its purest form is an act of us, us-ness, where I the actor and something which is acted upon, which in turn acts upon me, these are integral elements in any interaction. There's an us-ness, there's a me and a something else. In fact my entire capacity to perceive, to exist in this realm, depends on my perception. My consciousness and the way in which it perceives and interacts. So everything is an interaction, everything is a part of this Us which is constantly being created.
Time: 10.29
Where does renunciation actually fit in? What am I actually renouncing? I know that may seem a little bewildering. Because when you really think about renunciation you might boil it down to one thing, like when you, for example, take sanyasa. That's very black and white. Easy to understand, simplistic. One renounces family life, but if one wasn't married in the first place, which family is one renouncing? Interesting. What is one renouncing? How is one's life actually different?
3
..One could just say well it's like a vow of celibacy like the priests at least in the Catholic Church do. It's an idea that I'm going to dedicate myself to God. Okay, very boring, not a subject of interest to discuss. The entire thing can be placed within a small cup and than more or less it's the same for everybody in every respect. There are some who have this cup called renunciation they have some title we give them special food, whatever. Not interesting, not for me. Probably not for you, otherwise you probably wouldn't listen to me.
I want to talk about the real issue here which is detachment. Far more important - detachment. It's how you react to something, how you interact with something, how you perceive your existence in relationship to other people, other events or events, not other events? How you live?
Attachment and detachment is very important to discuss. It is the essence that allows one to enter into spiritual depth. It's when we speak about it, we realize than when we are totally attached to a, quote on quote and I don't mean that lightly, material existence. Meaning an existence which is in and of itself dedicated to things or power or money - also things in their own sense - or fame or bodily beauty and so on. Attachment to these things which are not directly related to essence.
So in spiritual life you want to not have the focus of your attention on things. You want to have your focus of attention on essence, which is an energy. You don't want to be attached to things, you want to be focused on energy.
Now the question is well what about detachment? If I'm focused on energy. Am I to understand, when I'm not attached to my body or I'm not attached to money or I'm not attached to power, that I have nothing to do with it. Well, you can't do anything without your body. You may be very much absorbed in energy but unless you are sitting in a cave somewhere completely in some energetic body, in another realm, you've got to have connection. And this is also obvious.
So okay, the usual way of understanding this philosophically is you use all these things in the service of God. Okay, fine. So that you are attached to the divine, you are detached from the mundane and you use the mundane in the service of the divine. And in that way you express your detachment perfectly. Yeah, it's not that simple. It sounds great, it is great, but it's not that simple. And that's the problem when we say, the devil is in the details. Right there in the detachment attachment thing, wow, all the details are in very tiny, little print. There's, we call them footnotes. Here's the title: "Use the body in the service of God". And than there's the paragraph of description which we just talked about. Yes, do things and service and engage in service and blah, blah, blah. But then there's all these footnotes.
4
..You know like number 1 very tiny print. "Yeah, but you got to do stuff that's not necessarily directly connected to service." Footnote number 2. "You have to eat but you can't just eat any old thing." Number 3. "You have to be very sensitive to the body." And number 4. "And who you interact with is very important." And number 5. "And watch out for stress." And number 6. "By the way you got to make money." And number 7. "You got to pay the rent." Number 8... You get my point? There're these millions of footnotes with all the details stuck in them.
It's like when you download a program to install on your computer. And than they say: "Where do you want to install it." You click okay. "Put your password in." (You) click okay." And than it says: "Agree to the terms and conditions." They show you two sentences with an okay button. And you say: "You think I'm really going to read all that?" Okay. In reality there's a billion footnotes, clauses. In this case this in this case that, in this case this in this case that. And when they want to get you on that they can, because they said it and you agreed. And if you go into court and say: "I didn't know what I was agreeing to." The judge says: "Well, tuff beans you agreed. If you are so stupid as to agree to something you don't know what you're doing, that's your problem."
Time: 19.40
So, life has all these footnotes. Attachment and detachment has all these footnotes. And finally we get to the point that I mentioned first, friends and family. Do you realize how many footnotes are in the friends and family category? Oh, my god! There's a billion. You think you had footnotes in the body category? That's only in millions. In the friends and family category you got billions.
Just like queen Kunti said: "All conflict is due to the interaction of people." All these disturbances, these duties, the interaction of individuals, social intercourse it was translated as, it just means the way in which we react and relate to others. You can renounce the universe. But unless you're sitting in a cave all by yourself you're going to get entangled with people, with their problems, with what they want out of you, demands, expectations. How do you deal with that?
Friends and Family. Now here's what I personally consider to be the most important factor in spiritual life which is been overlooked, suppressed, repressed, ignored, by any organization that tries to systematize spirituality. I know that's controversial. But I have seen it, I do see it. Every single problem I was faced with, and believe me when I was in ISKCON I dealt with it for almost thirty years of dealing with people's problems, from day one. And since than, same thing.
5
..Now, how do I live with that? How do you live with that? Because you have the same thing. You have the same exact situation where you're dealing with people, friends and family. The two most important thing to everybody. Now if it's not, if these are not the two most important things to you, that is very interesting. Why? Here's one way: Friends and family are not important to you because you have renounced all of this and you're servant of God alone, and you are dedicating yourself to everybody.
That's just like when people used to donate. I donated a car stupidly when I became a devotee and I was told it's not your car it belongs to Krishna. So I was wondering does Krishna do oil changes, will Krishna change the oil and the filter, will Krishna put air in the tires, will Krishna change the spark plugs? And here was (something) interesting. Because they also parked the car all over N.Y.City and they ran up thousands of dollars in parking tickets all in my name. The car was never serviced, thousands of dollars in parking tickets, and finally it was thrown away because it belonged to Krishna.
You can see where we're going here. I was no longer a friend or a family, I was just some tool. We all became tools who just gave things to Krishna, who by the way never used any of our things. It was used by other people who were not our friends and not our family, and where there was this disturbance. --- So, interesting, very interesting. Now you all know these stuff. So, I'm not going to talk about all this. I'm going right to the point of friends and family.
Why are friends and family important? Because when you pretend they're not important than you end up with being alone or trying to be the center of attention. You want to be the center of attention of this crowd in front of you, who are neither really friends or family, but are followers. Or you're just alone and miserable. Or you're surrounded by followers and miserable. Because you really are alone than.
Here's how I deal with the situation: I know I am not the center of the universe, I know I'm not terrible important, I know that my life is dedicated to service. I love to serve my deities. Every Sunday I just chock out a huge chunk of time and I take care of my deities and after that I take care of my family, my parents specifically - old. I know this is what I've got to do. Otherwise if I'm taking care of me what is going to happen? How much can you take care of yourself? What does it mean to take care of yourself?
Okay there's a limit. I have to eat properly, sleep properly, not be stressed out and crazy, I have to exercise, I have to maybe take some supplement. Being a vegan and all that stuff, you know, you need B12, need whatever you have to take. But I also have to care for others. If I don't care for others and I only care for myself, what does that mean? That means I'm selfish. I don't like being selfish. I've actually tried it. There have been a few occasions in my life when I tried out selfishness. Boy, did that not work! Really hated it. Selfishness and me are not friends.
6
..So you have to find a balance here. What you need to keep going and how to be of service. But the real issue here is the spiritual issue. Who are you? And that's why I like to talk about being of service. Because I like taking care of others. Not all the time, because I also have to take care of me. But I like taking care of others.
Because what's the use, let's say I have billions of Dollars and I'm sitting in some castle somewhere. I would go crazy. What would I do with it? I know exactly what I'd do with it. I open a charity. I would take care of people who are suffering. The homeless especially number one. I would take care of people with trauma, I would take care of animals who have been harmed or abused. I would make shelters for people who required shelter. I know exactly what I'd do with it. But again what do I need? I mean I have an iMac. I'm happy with it. I have a phone. Okay, not exactly a... It's just some cheap old thing. I'm happy with it.
What would be the... what would I do? You know, I eat pretty good. Money's not going to make that better. Eat from the garden when it's growing. Money definitely is not going to make that better. I already have good doctors. Selfishness or just living for oneself, it doesn't satisfy. You got to assist. So friends and family. Why? Family you may not have chosen. Maybe you did. You know maybe somewhere before you were born, than you were part of a process where a certain group of people were assembled for you. And you chose and understood you were given certain family members who are here to help you understand better about your life.
So in one sense you could say you didn't choose family. In another sense you could have chosen family. But even if you didn't choose your family, you can choose to who to ignore in your family now, or who to be more close to than others, who you don't care about. You choose that. You also choose to care.
Family, whether one wants to admit it or not, is the foundation of your life. It's your whole childhood, it's your whole upbringing, it's what you felt protected by. It's who you felt loved by, it's who took care of you when you needed it the most. Or maybe didn't take care of you when you need it it the most and caused a very deep wound in your heart. But still it's significant the most significant.
In fact you can look at many deviants in society or people who became terrorists or shooters or whatever. And you could probably - I'm not saying definitely I don't know - but you could probably pinpoint an issue within their family when they were young, which made them very disappointed. Or made them feel discouraged, or made them feel neglected, or made them feel abandoned, or made them feel something which today they're acting out in these very deviant way. Because family is that powerful.
7
..You, everyone of you, I don't care of who you are, I don't care how smart you think you are, you are carrying a whole truckload of stuff from your family. Good and bad. Depending on how lucky you are you may have more good than bad or whatever. But you are carrying it. And it affects you in ways you can't imagine. DNA, the biology, your cells, your behavioral modification that took place when you were very sensitive, you were molded into a particular format, you were susceptible to it.
So here you are today this embodiment of your family. And everybody loves to pretend it's not that way or maybe it is to some small extend. But it is. So you have one choice. Now you can embrace that and work with it, or you can reject it or ignore it. You're still working with it, but without understanding, without awareness, without effectual ability to heal yourself.
Time: 35.00
Now friends, friends are really interesting. I don't mean Facebook friends. I look at my Facebook account and there's like, I don't know how many hundreds. And out of them I go: "Well, who is that? I don't know. Who is that? I don't know." I mean real friends.
You know those people who if you need it they're there for you, those people who you can talk to. I don't mean throw your whole burden of existence on. They're not your therapist, they're your friends you can hang out, you can laugh together without worrying about making mistakes. In fact even the mistakes become funny. People who you can exchange with, you can share with, you can borrow things from, they borrow from you. People you do things for, people you like to be with.
The ultimate thing is people you can just sit around with without even talking and feel perfectly comfortable. Just happy to be together. Friends and family. Family is such a deep connection, you can't even describe it. A deep connection of love or a deep connection of just anger and frustration. Depends on who you are what you've been through. But it's deep. It's deep and you can't really describe it because it's inherent in your existence.
Detachment, let's visit it again. Does it work to be detached from your friends? Wow, what does it mean to be attached to your friends? Does it mean they can never not be with you or maybe they're doing something else in their life and you just let them do it? Or you don't let them do it? Or, attachment and detachment.
8
..How about a parent who says: "I love you, I will never give up on you, but I just can't be part of what you're doing right now and until something else works out I just cannot deal with it, I have to be detached from this?" That statement is incredible: "I love you, I'm there for you, I support you, but I can't be part of what you're doing right now, I can't deal with that, it's just I have to detach myself from it."
How about God? "I love you, I support you." This world the proof. Action speak louder than words. This world exists, it supports us. Action speak louder than words. God says, "I love you, I support you, but I am not directly involved in what you're doing, I'm detached from it while you engage in activities that harm yourself or harm others." There we see attachment and detachment, or rather love and freedom, working at the same time. Where we see the depth of divine love allowing and not allowing with detachment in the sense of the detached of the connection.
The connection is never severed, it's never separated, you're never detached from the connection. You might ignore it, not be aware of it, but you can't exist without that connection with God, because that's the support of everything.
Time: 40.23
This love, this acceptance. Acceptance is such an important part of friends and family. You accept them for who they are, because that's all they can be. They are who they are, you are who you are. You accept that. When you want to make them something they're not, that's where attachment comes in. "I don't like the way you are, I want you to be like this, because you are my friend or you're my family, and I want it this way." That's how selfishness and attachment manifest. Whereas love and detachment: "You are who you are, I accept that." It's my choice whether I want to be part of that or not, but I accept that you are who you are. I may not like everything you do, but I accept it, because that's who you are.
A parent might say: "That frustrates me to pieces. Here my child, who I've tried to take care of for so long, is doing this strange thing, acting in this strange way. I can't handle it." That's love speaking. The love is saying, "I can't handle it, it hurts me."
So, another aspect of life. Acting in a way which is not harming others. That's a kind of nonviolence. But violence is a very tricky issue, because when we think of violence we think of it in a very crush bang way. But sometimes violence can be in a very subtle glance. It's violence... You can take away that word violent and let's replace it with harm, cause harm. The motto of Hippokrates: "Do no harm." Interesting, in medical profession they have this motto: "Do no harm."
9
..So if you love you don't want to cause harm. Yet you can go crazy like that. You can just walk around on tip toe all day long trying not to cause harm. So either go nuts doing nothing or you become like Jains where you in India you wear the face mask and you cover everything and you have a little broom and you sweep the path in front of you, so you don't stepp on ants, so you don't do harm. Fabulous idea. In modern terms crazy. Straight into the mental institution if you were to imagine to be in New York City (shows sweeping) or in Moscow. They would put you away quick. But it's like if you believe in that 'do no harm, don't do violence,' that is logical conclusion. Don't stepp on things, don't squish things, a.s.o.
Time: 44.35
Now, love is the issue we're talking about ultimately. When we talk about friends and family we're not talking about just personal relationships, we're talking about love. When we talk about God in relationship with us, we're talking about love. Love is the real issue. If you want to add God as friends and family, love is the way. But love is very complex, because of all these issues. The parents love for the child is very powerful. Yet, it can cause the worst pain. "Do no harm!" And yet in love, so much pain. When the child does something totally self-destructive, the parent can't process it at all. Some kind of rejection or whatever.
There are circumstances in which love and harm are intimately related. Indeed, one can say the greatest harm comes with love, or the path to hell is paved with good intentions. That's another issue, but it sounded good when I said it.
So, our fundamental issue of being here in this world is related to that loving relationship between us and the divine, which somehow caused this division and created the greatest trauma of all existence which caused us to be here, somehow or another. So many interesting issues surrounding this love and the fundamental connection. Friends and family, the most intimate connections between loved ones, is the center of all of the difficulties we're facing.
And when we throw into this mixture renunciation, this meaningless term, when you consider it in the context that I just expressed how meaningless it is unless you understand it in a very narrow context. And how attachment and detachment are hand in hand tools by which we express love within the context of this most fundamental of all relationships, with our friends and family. And I'm including our deities, I'm including Radha and Krishna, I'm including the divine personalities and ourselves within the friends and family, because they are. And all of the ways in which we have done this dance of connection and disconnection, of attachment and detachment, and how our lives are this incredible mixture of all of these things. And sometimes we understand it and sometimes we don't. Sometimes we are wide awake and sometimes we are very asleep.
10
..You know previously in the past weeks I was talking about dimensional spaces and I got a lot of questions - obvious questions. For a lot of people would say: "How do we create the space in which we can associate with Krishna in his pastimes?" And I don't really like to say it, but I have to. Like: "Oh, come on, give me a break! What, do you kidding me? Do you really think it's that simple, you just create a space, you know, I taught you how to make spaces, I taught you how to create dimensions and how to feel dimensions, and you just make a dimension and there you are with Krishna."
I mean give me a break! If you can't even deal with friends and family, this fundamental stuff, if you can't even understand how your existence is simply to be of service to those you love, the fundamental ingredient being of service to those you love, how are you going to enter into, how are you going to creat the space where you and Radha and Krishna are dancing around in the forest? Give me a break!
And renunciation, you're renouncing the one thing that will give you the entrance into that dimension, you skipped it, and you want to get it by that? Don't forget that this renunciation jazz was born in India where family was number one issue, number one thing, where people spend the first 75 years of their life completely in this attachment of caring and loving and protecting and interacting and being concerned.
And this little part at the end, when anyway you're decrepit and old and irrelevant, you become renounced, and you travel from village to village and help people in whatever way you can, and get some food. It's not meant for people who have no clue whatsoever about friends and family, and who renounce something they have no clue what they're doing. And than perhaps reestablish friends and family in that situation.
If you want to creat that space you creat it with love, with your own love. And being of service for each and every personality, be they human, animal, plant, demigod, divine, Supreme, whatever. That same exact love, that same exact being of service, that same exact interaction, whatever is required to make it work in this relationship. That love. That's the essence of what we're doing here in this world. It's what I was speaking about before. How the real discipline of yoga is that to find being of service at every moment, while balancing this facility you're being given to be of service.
You got to paint your walls, you got to clean your room, you got to wash your cloth, you got to eat proper and blah, blah, blah... You know it, you can't give that up, and you can't give up being of service. Just being absorbed in yourself? Not enough. Just being of service? Not enough. Take care of yourself, be of service in the friends and family and anyone who needs you.
Hey, they're big words, I know. Okay, I don't do it all the time. But, you know, when I try to be selfish it's a big disaster. I'm terrible at being selfish. I just can't get it together. I try sometimes, yeah, I really do. I say, what about me? Doesn't work. But, you know, you got to learn this balance because this is the way that dimension is created. Where you're learning the balance between self and others, you're learning the balance between friends and family and yourself and love and care and responsibility, and maintenance and keeping things flowing, and being creative. Otherwise you'll just go nuts. You can't just be a servant all day. You've to be creative, you have to share.
I just felt this was an important topic for today. I don't know why. It just came to me this way, that I thought this was something important we should talk about. I hope you agreed. If not, I'm sorry. I tried to be of service. If so. Great, I was of service. That was my point
Friends and Family in the Context of Attachment and Renunciation and Divine Love ❤️
Re: Friends and Family in the Context of Attachment and Renunciation and Divine Love ❤️
A lecture by Hari broadcasted live on YouTube on 1.10.2016
Watch and listen to at: https://youtu.be/GxXH34J5Wzk
Questions and answers.
Time: 58.39
Question: "What about money? How to understand where is attachment or greed and where are your real needs?
Hari: Well, how about I focus on one word in this - real. You probably didn't think of I was going to focus on that word real. Where are our real needs, what is our real need? What is real? Is any need real? Here's a very weird example. I told you once long ago how I once had the situation where I had to have... I had these knots in my muscles. And I had to have a therapist with the knuckles and the elbows get them out. And the pain was through the roof, I was screaming my brains out. Until I realized either I can keep on screaming, because the whole office was... there were many other people in the office and they were just knocking on the door, what the hell is going on.
And than I felt I have to be more like a Buddhist about this. So I just took my entire consciousness and focused it on the pain. Because usually when there's pain you kind of like to scream and move your consciousness away from the pain, as if you are avoiding it. So I just stocked my consciousness right on that pain - not easy to do - but I just did it and just focused on the pain, and just felt the pain entirely.
And I stopped screaming. Not only that, I stopped feeling it in that way. For me it was like a universe of realization exploded. Because I used to hear how Stalin, you know good old, your buddy over there in Russia, so he had operation once and he didn't take any anesthetic, he did it completely - probably he thought someone is going to kill him when he was in the operating room. If I was Stalin I would think like that too. So, but he just had the... (operation) and he went through it. And I thought how does somebody do that? But than when I tried this technique - and believe me I'm never going to do that in an operation but bare with me - I understood that if you focus on it, it changes.
How about an itch. Did you ever have like an itch? Of course you do, everybody has itches. And so what do we usually do? We don't think about it, we just scratch. So I tried the same technique with an itch. Than I just focused on it, and it went away.
2
..Now, there's another thing involved here. There's a school of thought that when your body has some problem or there's some pain or there's something that feels diseased, it's because your body is trying to tell you something. There's a whole philosophy about this. So this particular technique is what you use. Pain in the liver, for example. Focus on it entirely, listen to what your body is telling you with this pain and do whatever is required, whatever you're hearing you focus on. Now the question is what is real? If I can make an itch go away by focusing on it, was the itch real? Or was it a figment of my imagination?
Let's say I'm hungry, is that real? Or let's say I go to Jasmuheen's seminar and I'm drinking all this energy. Like she once told somebody at a dinner, when they were wandering why she was pushing her food from one side of the plate to the other pretending like she was eating it. She said in all honesty to, she said: "I eat light." I love that comment, I thought it was great. (Hari laughs)
So, there's no hunger. Was the hunger real? Is it that something is real under some circumstance and not real under another circumstance. And if so, does the word has any meaning at all? Is there any meaning to the word real, like reality? I love it when people talk about reality, or get real. It's funny. I mean, we're creating, we're interacting, we're making things seem as they are by ourselves. We're doing this. So, is it real or not real. And if I have a desire, is it bad or is it just what it is. If I have a desire, there's a reason for it. Desires just don't pop up out of nowhere.
Like this guy, some guy in America they get a machine gun, they shoot people in a mall. Do you think he just woke up one morning and said: "Now, I'm going to shoot all these people, I have this desire, so, I'll just do it? It came from somewhere, it has an origin, there's a reason for it. Everybody in his life ignored the reason, including himself. Everybody ignored it. And so he woke up one morning and said: "Screw you!" When you ask, is it bad to have a desire which is not real or whatever? What is the real, real or this? I say, everything is important.
I say, needs in and of themselves are not the issue. Your life is important. If you have something in your life that's appearing, there's a reason for it, it is derived from something. Focus on it, focus on it completely. Understand what it is you're trying to fulfill? What need, what hunger are you trying to fulfill? There is a possibility, I don't mean to make the question insignificant, that was not what I meant, there are possibilities where you have needs so called that are illusory. Because even if you fulfill them, they don't give you anything - not a value. Or maybe you're trying to hold on to some kind of vaporous illusion that you think would make you feel better, but it's not.
3
..You see there are many things in life which we have to judge. If we have as our focus being of service, if we have as our focus that love which is being of service. And I don't mean where you think or anybody thinks that if you do this for somebody that's the best way to be of service. Like for example if you see somebody who is skinny and you take a piece of bread and you stuff it in their mouth. Think about that example: You feel you're going to be of service to the skinny person by feeding them, and they don't want to eat, otherwise why would they be so skinny. So I'm going to stuff some bread in their mouth, because it's good for them.
That's not being of service. First of all it's being crazy. Second of all it's violence and third of all it's just you being selfish. "I'm going to do good, it's going to make me feel good." A lot of time doing good for others doesn't make you feel good. A lot of times it makes you feel awful. Because you're going to do something which is so hard and maybe so heart branching. Anyway I think that we should respect ourselves to the degree where if we have to understand why we think the way we do, why we feel the way we do, why we need what we need, to go with it, to focus in on it, to understand the source of it, to try to cultivate an awareness of why it is so.
Now as far as money, everybody needs money. We need it to pay for stuff. Because this whole world works on stuff. We're exchanging goods and services nonstop. And we have to have the capital to do that. Getting money is not bad. Even getting tones of money is not bad if you use it right. And even if you don't use it right and it just comes to you. Now that's your problem, you have to deal with it. There's a reason for it. There's a reason for everything. Your karma is very much involved.
But let's say you're very greedy for money, but you can't get it, because you're incompetent. But you're so frustrated by that. Than I would say. Your greed is a problem, your greed is an impediment, and you should accept yourself. "I am incompetent, I can't do that, so I have to give up this greed because it's not getting me anywhere." Anyway, I think that's good enough for that question.
Somebody is asking: "Do we choose our friends before birth?
Hari: Hard to say. Maybe, in some cases, maybe not. Depends. Everything depends. So, you can do it or maybe you are assembled together for a reason, or maybe a lot of the friends you develop now are because you're developing yourself, you are expanding your horizons, you are evolving. And new people come into your life to help you with that evolutionary process. It's not that all your friends are chosen before. Maybe some at some time. But definitely it's transforming, it's changing. You are creating and others are coming to you. They're been send to you or you are attracting them to you. It's all happening all at the same time simultaneously.
4
Somebody's me: In other words renunciation is making only harm?
Hari: Hm, I have to think about that. Maybe. I would get rid of the word only. Renunciation can bring one to a situation where you harm yourself or you harm others. Yes. Does it always mean that? I don't know. Depends on the situation. I don't think, when you deal in absolute terms you'll be very successful. Absolute terms are, I would say, very distracting. Because nothing is absolute when it comes to human relationships.
Comment, question: Very hot topic today, caring for a family brings us closer to God. Is God attracted by this? Does he somehow react to this?
Hari: I don't think that you should take it that if you just become, if you care for your family you become automatically closer to God. That was not what I said. Although I do understand how that could be inferred. What I did say was the exact same mechanism of love, of care, of being of service, of making an us, win-win connection with our family and our friends, is the exact same way in which that is translated in our spiritual life to God or the celestial beings, because they're also family and friends. It's the exact same methodology, if I would use a word which has all kinds of other meanings. But I mean to say love, service, caring, responsibility, all of this, yes, is attractive to God because it's part of our relationship, where God loves us, supports us unconditionally. And yet doesn't react with us all the time if we are acting in ways which are harmful to our own best interests. In a similar way with the family.
Question: Is it possible to develop oversensitivity for smells?
Hari: Oh yeah, I have that too. Flowers, instance, almost kill me. Why? Well, if I have this very powerful smells that so overpower me I can't focus on them to come to the conclusion of why. They just kill me. So, I can't think even. So, yes, it's very possible. Why? I don't know, doctors don't know. Take my word for it. Alogists don't know. All they know is that it's so, maybe you need a pill, maybe you need to avoid it. Why? Millions of reasons. They don't know why. And if they say they do know why, always because of histamines blah, blah, blah... That's not the answer to the question.
5
Comment by someone: Thank you Hari. I have been thinking lately about the story of Bharat Maharaja and a deer. Was it attachment or love? I want to say more but don't want to make my question too long.
Hari: Perfect example of what I'm talking about. Bharat Maharaja attempted renunciation. Give it all up! It didn't work. Generally it doesn't work like that. And his example was perfect. So, deer came along. His love needed to be expressed. He was a loving person. Who was he? He cared about all the people. He protected all the people. This was his character. And that's how he expressed his love. That's how he expressed his spirituality. And when he tried to be something else, it didn't work. It doesn't matter whether it was attachment or love. It was the reaction to trying to be something you're not or of not accepting yourself. All this discussion about it being attachment and bad or whatever - not important. Not even the issue.
The real issue was, not accepting the self. He was fine as he was. He tried to be more. It didn't work. My opinion. I'm sure there's a million people out there who'll argue left and right. Just telling you that's my opinion.
Time: 1.20.32
Question: Why do many teachers of different traditions make people take renunciation when people are still very young?
Hari: Because they're not very good at what they do? Because there're not very experienced in life themselves? Because they're recklessly playing with people's lives? Because they're experimenting for something self interested in themselves? I don't know. Maybe, maybe not. Maybe they just think it's the right thing to do. Maybe they were told to do it, and they think, sure. Maybe they read it in a book, and they accepted this as absolute. And they said, that's what I will do. I do not think people do it, that teachers do that because they want to hurt you. I don't think they do it because they want to harm. I think it's ignorance or misunderstanding or blind following themselves. Again, there's going to be a lot of arguing about that one.
Comment: And maybe teachers have their hidden motivations.
Hari: Naa, maybe to make money, I don't know. But that's also not very... Yes, economics, sure. You serve God. How do you serve God? You serve the church, you make money, you bring money to support the church. Which means supporting the priests or supporting whatever, or... Yeah, maybe motivations are involved. That we've talked about many times.
6
But if you're talking about specifically renunciation, not just serving the organization. No, I don't think hidden motivations. Maybe they had very bad family lives themselves and want you to avoid that. That may be the hidden motivation. But again that's care. Their way of expressing care. Even though it's not very practical or doesn't get them the result they think it's going to get. Again, I don't want to get into, like these are bad people for this. I'm having enough trouble with simply saying it's out of ignorance.
Comment: It's interesting that Lord Krishna was so much into family and friends.
Hari: Yeah, light bulbs, ting. Mahabharata, Shrimad Bhagavatam. Family, friends, unlimited. Lord Caitanya's first part of his life all family and friends. Second part lot's of friends no more family, still friends.
Question: Is it possible that renunciation helps teachers to get the student to the inner spiritual world? Can it be an elevator?
Hari: Well, I think that in my lecture I explained the issues about that. So I don't really want to go back into that again.
Question: How do you become more dependent on God and less dependent on the tools of detachment and attachment?
Hari: Depends on what you mean. If you mean dependent on God which means everything, you know, like Krishna changes the oil in your car, or God sends me the money I need or, you know, God cleans my house. Because you know, when somebody says, I'm totally dependent on God. You don't know what they mean anymore. Because there's a million things it could mean.
Just because you're dependent on God doesn't mean you're hanging on God like some anchor or you're expecting to be taken care of completely like a little baby in the arms. And if you think of it in that way, that you are standing there in complete connection. Part of maintaining that connection is to use your conscious consciousness, your awareness, your intelligence to know when attachment benefits that connection or when detachment benefits that connection.
So these tools are always there because they are the way in which intelligence discriminates between situations or events or feelings or energies to maintain the proper balance of the energetic exchange of love in any relationships. What to speak of with the Supreme, with Radha and Krishna.
..
Watch and listen to at: https://youtu.be/GxXH34J5Wzk
Questions and answers.
Time: 58.39
Question: "What about money? How to understand where is attachment or greed and where are your real needs?
Hari: Well, how about I focus on one word in this - real. You probably didn't think of I was going to focus on that word real. Where are our real needs, what is our real need? What is real? Is any need real? Here's a very weird example. I told you once long ago how I once had the situation where I had to have... I had these knots in my muscles. And I had to have a therapist with the knuckles and the elbows get them out. And the pain was through the roof, I was screaming my brains out. Until I realized either I can keep on screaming, because the whole office was... there were many other people in the office and they were just knocking on the door, what the hell is going on.
And than I felt I have to be more like a Buddhist about this. So I just took my entire consciousness and focused it on the pain. Because usually when there's pain you kind of like to scream and move your consciousness away from the pain, as if you are avoiding it. So I just stocked my consciousness right on that pain - not easy to do - but I just did it and just focused on the pain, and just felt the pain entirely.
And I stopped screaming. Not only that, I stopped feeling it in that way. For me it was like a universe of realization exploded. Because I used to hear how Stalin, you know good old, your buddy over there in Russia, so he had operation once and he didn't take any anesthetic, he did it completely - probably he thought someone is going to kill him when he was in the operating room. If I was Stalin I would think like that too. So, but he just had the... (operation) and he went through it. And I thought how does somebody do that? But than when I tried this technique - and believe me I'm never going to do that in an operation but bare with me - I understood that if you focus on it, it changes.
How about an itch. Did you ever have like an itch? Of course you do, everybody has itches. And so what do we usually do? We don't think about it, we just scratch. So I tried the same technique with an itch. Than I just focused on it, and it went away.
2
..Now, there's another thing involved here. There's a school of thought that when your body has some problem or there's some pain or there's something that feels diseased, it's because your body is trying to tell you something. There's a whole philosophy about this. So this particular technique is what you use. Pain in the liver, for example. Focus on it entirely, listen to what your body is telling you with this pain and do whatever is required, whatever you're hearing you focus on. Now the question is what is real? If I can make an itch go away by focusing on it, was the itch real? Or was it a figment of my imagination?
Let's say I'm hungry, is that real? Or let's say I go to Jasmuheen's seminar and I'm drinking all this energy. Like she once told somebody at a dinner, when they were wandering why she was pushing her food from one side of the plate to the other pretending like she was eating it. She said in all honesty to, she said: "I eat light." I love that comment, I thought it was great. (Hari laughs)
So, there's no hunger. Was the hunger real? Is it that something is real under some circumstance and not real under another circumstance. And if so, does the word has any meaning at all? Is there any meaning to the word real, like reality? I love it when people talk about reality, or get real. It's funny. I mean, we're creating, we're interacting, we're making things seem as they are by ourselves. We're doing this. So, is it real or not real. And if I have a desire, is it bad or is it just what it is. If I have a desire, there's a reason for it. Desires just don't pop up out of nowhere.
Like this guy, some guy in America they get a machine gun, they shoot people in a mall. Do you think he just woke up one morning and said: "Now, I'm going to shoot all these people, I have this desire, so, I'll just do it? It came from somewhere, it has an origin, there's a reason for it. Everybody in his life ignored the reason, including himself. Everybody ignored it. And so he woke up one morning and said: "Screw you!" When you ask, is it bad to have a desire which is not real or whatever? What is the real, real or this? I say, everything is important.
I say, needs in and of themselves are not the issue. Your life is important. If you have something in your life that's appearing, there's a reason for it, it is derived from something. Focus on it, focus on it completely. Understand what it is you're trying to fulfill? What need, what hunger are you trying to fulfill? There is a possibility, I don't mean to make the question insignificant, that was not what I meant, there are possibilities where you have needs so called that are illusory. Because even if you fulfill them, they don't give you anything - not a value. Or maybe you're trying to hold on to some kind of vaporous illusion that you think would make you feel better, but it's not.
3
..You see there are many things in life which we have to judge. If we have as our focus being of service, if we have as our focus that love which is being of service. And I don't mean where you think or anybody thinks that if you do this for somebody that's the best way to be of service. Like for example if you see somebody who is skinny and you take a piece of bread and you stuff it in their mouth. Think about that example: You feel you're going to be of service to the skinny person by feeding them, and they don't want to eat, otherwise why would they be so skinny. So I'm going to stuff some bread in their mouth, because it's good for them.
That's not being of service. First of all it's being crazy. Second of all it's violence and third of all it's just you being selfish. "I'm going to do good, it's going to make me feel good." A lot of time doing good for others doesn't make you feel good. A lot of times it makes you feel awful. Because you're going to do something which is so hard and maybe so heart branching. Anyway I think that we should respect ourselves to the degree where if we have to understand why we think the way we do, why we feel the way we do, why we need what we need, to go with it, to focus in on it, to understand the source of it, to try to cultivate an awareness of why it is so.
Now as far as money, everybody needs money. We need it to pay for stuff. Because this whole world works on stuff. We're exchanging goods and services nonstop. And we have to have the capital to do that. Getting money is not bad. Even getting tones of money is not bad if you use it right. And even if you don't use it right and it just comes to you. Now that's your problem, you have to deal with it. There's a reason for it. There's a reason for everything. Your karma is very much involved.
But let's say you're very greedy for money, but you can't get it, because you're incompetent. But you're so frustrated by that. Than I would say. Your greed is a problem, your greed is an impediment, and you should accept yourself. "I am incompetent, I can't do that, so I have to give up this greed because it's not getting me anywhere." Anyway, I think that's good enough for that question.
Somebody is asking: "Do we choose our friends before birth?
Hari: Hard to say. Maybe, in some cases, maybe not. Depends. Everything depends. So, you can do it or maybe you are assembled together for a reason, or maybe a lot of the friends you develop now are because you're developing yourself, you are expanding your horizons, you are evolving. And new people come into your life to help you with that evolutionary process. It's not that all your friends are chosen before. Maybe some at some time. But definitely it's transforming, it's changing. You are creating and others are coming to you. They're been send to you or you are attracting them to you. It's all happening all at the same time simultaneously.
4
Somebody's me: In other words renunciation is making only harm?
Hari: Hm, I have to think about that. Maybe. I would get rid of the word only. Renunciation can bring one to a situation where you harm yourself or you harm others. Yes. Does it always mean that? I don't know. Depends on the situation. I don't think, when you deal in absolute terms you'll be very successful. Absolute terms are, I would say, very distracting. Because nothing is absolute when it comes to human relationships.
Comment, question: Very hot topic today, caring for a family brings us closer to God. Is God attracted by this? Does he somehow react to this?
Hari: I don't think that you should take it that if you just become, if you care for your family you become automatically closer to God. That was not what I said. Although I do understand how that could be inferred. What I did say was the exact same mechanism of love, of care, of being of service, of making an us, win-win connection with our family and our friends, is the exact same way in which that is translated in our spiritual life to God or the celestial beings, because they're also family and friends. It's the exact same methodology, if I would use a word which has all kinds of other meanings. But I mean to say love, service, caring, responsibility, all of this, yes, is attractive to God because it's part of our relationship, where God loves us, supports us unconditionally. And yet doesn't react with us all the time if we are acting in ways which are harmful to our own best interests. In a similar way with the family.
Question: Is it possible to develop oversensitivity for smells?
Hari: Oh yeah, I have that too. Flowers, instance, almost kill me. Why? Well, if I have this very powerful smells that so overpower me I can't focus on them to come to the conclusion of why. They just kill me. So, I can't think even. So, yes, it's very possible. Why? I don't know, doctors don't know. Take my word for it. Alogists don't know. All they know is that it's so, maybe you need a pill, maybe you need to avoid it. Why? Millions of reasons. They don't know why. And if they say they do know why, always because of histamines blah, blah, blah... That's not the answer to the question.
5
Comment by someone: Thank you Hari. I have been thinking lately about the story of Bharat Maharaja and a deer. Was it attachment or love? I want to say more but don't want to make my question too long.
Hari: Perfect example of what I'm talking about. Bharat Maharaja attempted renunciation. Give it all up! It didn't work. Generally it doesn't work like that. And his example was perfect. So, deer came along. His love needed to be expressed. He was a loving person. Who was he? He cared about all the people. He protected all the people. This was his character. And that's how he expressed his love. That's how he expressed his spirituality. And when he tried to be something else, it didn't work. It doesn't matter whether it was attachment or love. It was the reaction to trying to be something you're not or of not accepting yourself. All this discussion about it being attachment and bad or whatever - not important. Not even the issue.
The real issue was, not accepting the self. He was fine as he was. He tried to be more. It didn't work. My opinion. I'm sure there's a million people out there who'll argue left and right. Just telling you that's my opinion.
Time: 1.20.32
Question: Why do many teachers of different traditions make people take renunciation when people are still very young?
Hari: Because they're not very good at what they do? Because there're not very experienced in life themselves? Because they're recklessly playing with people's lives? Because they're experimenting for something self interested in themselves? I don't know. Maybe, maybe not. Maybe they just think it's the right thing to do. Maybe they were told to do it, and they think, sure. Maybe they read it in a book, and they accepted this as absolute. And they said, that's what I will do. I do not think people do it, that teachers do that because they want to hurt you. I don't think they do it because they want to harm. I think it's ignorance or misunderstanding or blind following themselves. Again, there's going to be a lot of arguing about that one.
Comment: And maybe teachers have their hidden motivations.
Hari: Naa, maybe to make money, I don't know. But that's also not very... Yes, economics, sure. You serve God. How do you serve God? You serve the church, you make money, you bring money to support the church. Which means supporting the priests or supporting whatever, or... Yeah, maybe motivations are involved. That we've talked about many times.
6
But if you're talking about specifically renunciation, not just serving the organization. No, I don't think hidden motivations. Maybe they had very bad family lives themselves and want you to avoid that. That may be the hidden motivation. But again that's care. Their way of expressing care. Even though it's not very practical or doesn't get them the result they think it's going to get. Again, I don't want to get into, like these are bad people for this. I'm having enough trouble with simply saying it's out of ignorance.
Comment: It's interesting that Lord Krishna was so much into family and friends.
Hari: Yeah, light bulbs, ting. Mahabharata, Shrimad Bhagavatam. Family, friends, unlimited. Lord Caitanya's first part of his life all family and friends. Second part lot's of friends no more family, still friends.
Question: Is it possible that renunciation helps teachers to get the student to the inner spiritual world? Can it be an elevator?
Hari: Well, I think that in my lecture I explained the issues about that. So I don't really want to go back into that again.
Question: How do you become more dependent on God and less dependent on the tools of detachment and attachment?
Hari: Depends on what you mean. If you mean dependent on God which means everything, you know, like Krishna changes the oil in your car, or God sends me the money I need or, you know, God cleans my house. Because you know, when somebody says, I'm totally dependent on God. You don't know what they mean anymore. Because there's a million things it could mean.
Just because you're dependent on God doesn't mean you're hanging on God like some anchor or you're expecting to be taken care of completely like a little baby in the arms. And if you think of it in that way, that you are standing there in complete connection. Part of maintaining that connection is to use your conscious consciousness, your awareness, your intelligence to know when attachment benefits that connection or when detachment benefits that connection.
So these tools are always there because they are the way in which intelligence discriminates between situations or events or feelings or energies to maintain the proper balance of the energetic exchange of love in any relationships. What to speak of with the Supreme, with Radha and Krishna.
..